stormtheunissen

Channel 4 documentary

87 posts in this topic

Hi everyone,

Award-winning production company Yipp Films are developing a potential documentary for Channel 4 about male clients of sex workers. We want to make a film which focuses on British punters in a completely straight, honest, sensitive and non- judgmental way. We're interested in speaking to punters about their involvement with the sex workers and why they've the right to pay for sex; exploring just how commercial sex fits into their lives, hopes and fears, and shapes their relationships with others.

Those who pay for sex now find themselves increasingly scorned and criminalised by the government's Policing and Crime Bill currently going through Parliament. In its attempt to protect women from violence, many clients, experts and sex workers we've spoken to say this law will further target and demonise all punters and encroach on people's private sex lives even more than is already the case. This film will examine whether this law is misguided and unjust. This project has the full support of sex industry bodies such as the English Collective of Prostitutes, as well as others.

If you are a regular user of prostitutes and are interested in sharing your story and opinions or hearing more about this project, we would love to hear from you. There is no pressure to go on camera - if you just want to have an initial chat on the phone, converse via email or meet for an informal chat - that's fine. We understand the sensitivities and will keep all conversations and information strictly confidential and off the record. There's no problem if you'd like to stay anonymous at this stage.

Yipp Films are a Bafta award-winning production company with a long history of sensitive and truthful documentaries for British television. Our director, Patrick Collerton, is one of the most celebrated documentary makers of recent years, whose first film for Channel 4, The Boy Whose Skin Fell Off, won dozens of major awards around the world. If you visit our website (www.yippfilms.com) you can see his show reel and read a bit more about us. I am a journalist and producer with a particular interest in criminal justice issues; my most recent film was a feature documentary on BBC2 called Going Postal, focusing on the phenomenon of workplace and school shootings. We're certainly not alarmist, tabloid TV hacks.

I hope to hear from you.

With thanks and kind regards,

Storm Theunissen

Producer

Yipp Films

storm@yippfilms.com

www.yippfilms.com

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Sorry I should just clarify: if you wish to stay anonymous at all times then of course we will honour this.

We really do wish to be open, honest and non-alarmist in this film, allowing punters to speak freely and in their own words - a first in British television for this subject.

Thanks very much for your time.

Storm

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interesting name, sounds like your from the x-men ;)

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Ha! Thanks. It's my real name too. Hippy parents etc etc

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As a sex worker, what changed my mind was how pitiable most the clients were. Before I'd thought they'd all be rich, sexist, paying only to get the 'dehumanising' element. But many are just lonely, sweet, very friendly - and the power dynamic was, as an attractive young woman, in my hands.

Having said that, there's much to be said for the 'paying for consent' theory. Clients know you don't want sex and have no shame - will you be exploring this element in your documentary?

p.s. I'm not here to get clients, hence the honesty.

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imho there's something inherently wrong with 50 year olds getting 18 year olds to pleasure them and be nice to them, just so the 18 year old can get extra pocket money.

The majority of prostitutes apparently start work before 18.

No matter how you paint the picture, or how many decent guys you get on your documentary, society understands there's something fundamentally wrong about prostitution. Otherwise it would be completely mainstream and it's never been at any point in history - I'll circulate this little post from channel 4 to punternet. com round though.

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society understands there's something fundamentally wrong about prostitution. Otherwise it would be completely mainstream and it's never been at any point in history

That is very debatable. Have a read of Ringdal's Love for Sale (about £15 from Amazon) and consider (i) temple prostitution in ancient Sumeria, (ii) classical Greece and Rome, (iii) Japan under the Shogunate and (iv) modern Thailand. All very mainstream... I'd suggest that the acceptability of prostitution, like that of homosexuality, has fluctuated with time and place since time immemorial.

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Having said that, there's much to be said for the 'paying for consent' theory. Clients know you don't want sex and have no shame

You make a good point, does it work the other way, the "Always wet and up for it" brigade know they don't want sex, do they have no shame?

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lets put it bluntly this site is full of perverts like SaSfan.

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lets put it bluntly this site is full of perverts like SaSfan.

They have my most heartfelt commiserations.

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Notme -

Thanks very much for that. I think what we want to do more than anything give is an open and honest portrayal of punters... neither sensationalist, cliched nor rose-tinted. Broadly hearing people's human stories - but engaging with the political issues too. Which of course take in the points you make.

Thanks very much for offering to pass round this post - it's very much appreciated.

Storm

imho there's something inherently wrong with 50 year olds getting 18 year olds to pleasure them and be nice to them, just so the 18 year old can get extra pocket money.

The majority of prostitutes apparently start work before 18.

No matter how you paint the picture, or how many decent guys you get on your documentary, society understands there's something fundamentally wrong about prostitution. Otherwise it would be completely mainstream and it's never been at any point in history - I'll circulate this little post from channel 4 to punternet. com round though.

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From my point of view most of my punters are sexy, groomed , respectable and just want a change or escape the boredom of their relationship or just too busy for a relationship and it is a service i offer happily. After a string of failed relationships and thinking where i went wrong and having the impression that everytime a man gives me that lursting look i felt like spitting in their face .I thaught to myself forget about your dream of ever finding a man who will be interested in you other than your pair of legs and your derriere, maybe there is a way of coming to a solution. I offer my company and i get a bit of cash and we both get to have mad sex..... everyone is happy and leaves with a smile.

So this channel 4 documentary wants to know why men use sex workers is because it is the easiest way of having some sort of intimacy without jeopardising your work, relationship etc instead of having a girlfriend or a mistress who can easily turn your life upside down.

For me, i guess it works for me because i love sex and dont really have a room for a relationship and i can get to do what i want when i want.

For girls who are in this for just the money will end up depressed because it involves loads of sex and energy. So for me, i have found the right balance for now and as for the punters , a man is gotta be a man and has needs and fantasies that not only one woman can satisfy so we , escorts are here to fulfill them.

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imho there's something inherently wrong with 50 year olds getting 18 year olds to pleasure them and be nice to them, just so the 18 year old can get extra pocket money.

Whilst I can sympathise with this point, it does beg the question; which might actually bear consideration by either academic study or the documentary makers themselves, as to how typical the scenario you describe actually is.

What I mean to say is, is it as common a situation as some would have us believe or is the experience of the WG I see on a regular basis; who is also a very close friend outside of the working environment, who says that the age range of her cllients tends to be more within the late 20s - late 40s/early 50s more typical?

The majority of prostitutes apparently start work before 18.

This depends on who you read & which market they are studying. Besides the fact that engaging in sex work under the age of 18 is illegal, the majority of studies reporting such findings tend to concentrate on the street market; which only consitutes at most 10 - 15% of the whole, ignore the much larger indoor market (i.e. massage parlours, brothels & escorting) or are produced in order to promote an anti-prostitution agenda.

Again, you've managed to find a rich area of research for the documentary makers. (Seriously, good on you for raising another common conception that reallly does need the facts investigating & presenting to the public).

No matter how you paint the picture, or how many decent guys you get on your documentary, society understands there's something fundamentally wrong about prostitution. Otherwise it would be completely mainstream and it's never been at any point in history - I'll circulate this little post from channel 4 to punternet. com round though.

As others have pointed out, this is not quite the case; one need only look at the "Turin Erotic Papyrus", Sumerian art & texts or Greek & Roman documents to realise this; even in Middle Ages England, there were instances of monasteries earng a large part of their income from ownership of brothels, to see that, at times not only was sex work/prostitution seen as being acceptable & perfectly normal, but, in some cases, a relligious duty.

Again, a very interesting line of investigation for the film makers.

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notme:

Should have added to the above (Damn the fact there doesn't appear to be an edit function, that my WG friend is in the middle of the specified age range I mentioned in response to your first point.

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notme:

Should have added to the above (Damn the fact there doesn't appear to be an edit function, that my WG friend is in the middle of the specified age range I mentioned in response to your first point.

You can edit a post, but you have to select the edit option AND COMPLETE any editing within 5 minutes of submitting the original post.

The Edit button is displayed to the left of the Quote button during this 5 minute period.

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Ha, that's why I never see the option. Dyslexia means I tend to re-read posts a couple of times after I make them:)

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From my point of view most of my punters are sexy, groomed , respectable and just want a change or escape the boredom of their relationship or just too busy for a relationship and it is a service i offer happily. After a string of failed relationships and thinking where i went wrong and having the impression that everytime a man gives me that lursting look i felt like spitting in their face .I thaught to myself forget about your dream of ever finding a man who will be interested in you other than your pair of legs and your derriere, maybe there is a way of coming to a solution. I offer my company and i get a bit of cash and we both get to have mad sex..... everyone is happy and leaves with a smile.

So this channel 4 documentary wants to know why men use sex workers is because it is the easiest way of having some sort of intimacy without jeopardising your work, relationship etc instead of having a girlfriend or a mistress who can easily turn your life upside down.

For me, i guess it works for me because i love sex and dont really have a room for a relationship and i can get to do what i want when i want.

For girls who are in this for just the money will end up depressed because it involves loads of sex and energy. So for me, i have found the right balance for now and as for the punters , a man is gotta be a man and has needs and fantasies that not only one woman can satisfy so we , escorts are here to fulfill them.

Hmmmmm

You just nailed it

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That is very debatable. Have a read of Ringdal's Love for Sale (about £15 from Amazon) and consider (i) temple prostitution in ancient Sumeria, (ii) classical Greece and Rome, (iii) Japan under the Shogunate and (iv) modern Thailand. All very mainstream... I'd suggest that the acceptability of prostitution, like that of homosexuality, has fluctuated with time and place since time immemorial.

Couldn't agree more...

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Besides the fact that engaging in sex work under the age of 18 is illegal

Are you saying that a person under the age of 18 can be prosecuted for suppling sexual services for gain?

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Are you saying that a person under the age of 18 can be prosecuted for suppling sexual services for gain?

Don't answer - it's a trap.

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After a string of failed relationships and thinking where i went wrong and having the impression that everytime a man gives me that lursting look i felt like spitting in their face .I thaught to myself forget about your dream of ever finding a man who will be interested in you other than your pair of legs and your derriere

Let me just try and defend at least the more civilised members of my gender on this point - it may well be your legs, bum, tits (actually, more likely your face) that gets our attention at first, but it's personality and compatibility that we also look for in a long-term relationship (ownership of a brewery/distillery a distinct advantage LOL). But without that first spark of interest there's really no point.

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We want to make a film which focuses on British punters in a completely straight, honest, sensitive and non- judgmental way.

And you're doing this for Channel Four, a channel whose flagship programme is Big Brother, which takes people as close to being mentally ill as they dare get away with and then manipulates, humiliates an mind-fucks them on public TV and invites us to enjoy it as entertainment. To judge by the company you keep it would be a miracle if you manage to produce something straight, honest & sensitive. Let's face it; bottom line- you are in the entertainment business.

I know two people, one a prostitute, who were fucked over big time by the media and wouldn't come near any of you with a barge-pole. At the end of the day your participants will have no editorial control, you'll be able to portray them as you see fit and (especially given the subject matter) there will be no effective right of reply. Put my reputation in your hands? I think not. Personally I'd only participate in something like this if it were an academic study with proper research protocols and supervisors in place (As happened with Dr Sander's study which several of us took part in a while back).

Pardon my cynicism, and pardon my putting you in the same category as Sun/NOTW "journalists" but personally I choose not to trust any of you.

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And you're doing this for Channel Four, a channel whose flagship programme is Big Brother, which takes people as close to being mentally ill as they dare get away with and then manipulates, humiliates an mind-fucks them on public TV and invites us to enjoy it as entertainment. To judge by the company you keep it would be a miracle if you manage to produce something straight, honest & sensitive. Let's face it; bottom line- you are in the entertainment business.

I know two people, one a prostitute, who were fucked over big time by the media and wouldn't come near any of you with a barge-pole. At the end of the day your participants will have no editorial control, you'll be able to portray them as you see fit and (especially given the subject matter) there will be no effective right of reply. Put my reputation in your hands? I think not. Personally I'd only participate in something like this if it were an academic study with proper research protocols and supervisors in place (As happened with Dr Sander's study which several of us took part in a while back).

Pardon my cynicism, and pardon my putting you in the same category as Sun/NOTW "journalists" but personally I choose not to trust any of you.

I've been in touch with St Teela of Leeds and she has given her blessing to the project and the journalist.

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I've been in touch with St Teela of Leeds and she has given her blessing to the project and the journalist.

I'm still not clear what distinguishes this guy from the procession of lazy journos who come here making 'trust me I'm an award winning journo' noises and expect to get a response without doing anything further to earn trust. Teela took her time to make contacts with key 'insiders' who could then speak for her. She was also able to give assurances about quality control, in that she was employed by a proper university and her work was being monitored by an ethics committee and a proper academic supervisor.

This guy may be Jesus Christ incarnate but in my view he needs to do more than this to demonstrate his credentials, and be a bit more explicit about how he will ensure that things are going to be 'sensitive and non-judgmental'.

For starters: "This project has the full support of sex industry bodies such as the English Collective of Prostitutes...." How can he show that to be true?. ".... as well as others." Which others?

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I'm still not clear what distinguishes this guy from the procession of lazy journos who come here making 'trust me I'm an award winning journo' noises and expect to get a response without doing anything further to earn trust. Teela took her time to make contacts with key 'insiders' who could then speak for her. She was also able to give assurances about quality control, in that she was employed by a proper university and her work was being monitored by an ethics committee and a proper academic supervisor.

This guy may be Jesus Christ incarnate but in my view he needs to do more than this to demonstrate his credentials, and be a bit more explicit about how he will ensure that things are going to be 'sensitive and non-judgmental'.

For starters: "This project has the full support of sex industry bodies such as the English Collective of Prostitutes...." How can he show that to be true?. ".... as well as others." Which others?

I cannot answer any of your questions, Biggus - except that 'this guy' is a gal.

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