widdlewilly

Trafficking. The Giveaway Clues?

56 posts in this topic

Well it's no good asking them is it, because they are obviously terrified. With the amount of Oriental/ Asian girls on offer now I would be absolutely mortified to think I am having a liaison with a terrified girl against her will. So any tips on what to look out for?

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Well it's no good asking them is it, because they are obviously terrified. With the amount of Oriental/ Asian girls on offer now I would be absolutely mortified to think I am having a liaison with a terrified girl against her will. So any tips on what to look out for?

Are you sure you're not confusing 'trafficked' with 'kidnapped', 'coerced' and/or 'exploited'? Many people are trafficked perfectly willingly both into, out of and around the UK, and are not necessarily 'terrified' of anything - the term only refers to being moved from one location to another.

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I think the way I am using the term is pretty obvious without getting into the ins and outs of the Oxford Concise dictionary. :)

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I think the way I am using the term is pretty obvious without getting into the ins and outs of the Oxford Concise dictionary. :)

Sorry, I thought the legal aspect was what you were concerned about. That is, the fact that you can be prosecuted for paying (or even booking with the intention of paying) to have sex with somebody who is 'coerced, deceived or exploited', but not with somebody who is 'trafficked'. I doubt the people behind a dictionary give a flying fuck either way.

If you just want to avoid having sex with a prositute who would rather not be a prostitute, why do you think that being 'trafficked' is relevant to this?

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Well it's no good asking them is it, because they are obviously terrified. With the amount of Oriental/ Asian girls on offer now I would be absolutely mortified to think I am having a liaison with a terrified girl against her will. So any tips on what to look out for?
Firstly read Bottom Liners Defining Trafficking sticky thread in the Legalities Board. Remember there is Trafficking and Coercion in the mix here. If a woman looks uncomfortable, upset or distressed i would view that as a possible sign, note i say possible because i as a punter have little to go on. Calling Crimestoppers or the police is something to be done only when you believe going on your best judgement that a woman is being forced against her will, if your wrong it could mean she gets deported or at least loses her job so its not a decision to take lightly in my view. Fortunately i have never had to make such a decision in my 29 years of punting, never knowingly meeting a woman who i believed was being forced or been trafficked. Punternets advice is to ring Crimestoppers which i would do anonymously if i had to make such a terrible call.

Some women on Bonds voluntarily agree to be bonded so other posters on here have posted so they come here from places like Thailand on perhaps a student visa and agree to pay back the fare plus usually a lot more compared to just the actual cost of her traffickers getting her here to their traffickers or associates by working as a WG for them till its paid off. Of course this practice is illegal and in my view wholly wrong and i hope the tougher immigration laws for people from outside the EU severly restrict this practice. Clearly a woman coming here voluntarily is better than being made to against their wills, and i appreciate the difference, however i dont agree with either way and would never knowingly wish to punt with WGs in either scenario. What i would like to see are very very much harsher sentences for traffickers, in fact a mandatory life sentence for such scum.

A woman should come here by legal means or not at all so those that voluntarily agree to bonds may well be willing but it doesnt make it right in my eyes. I have read the reasoning, to get a better life for them and their families, i can understand that but its morally wrong to me to punt with such a woman knowingly.

Edited by smiths

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I think the way I am using the term is pretty obvious without getting into the ins and outs of the Oxford Concise dictionary. :)

I hope you're aware of what you're saying here?

I have NEVER seen an Oriental girl who was trafficked in about 20 years. Hardly any have so called 'bonds' and if they do, they're looked after.

I know others will disagree, but this is my experience.

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An establishment in West Drayton was busted,(had premises in Surbiton too), mainly Oriental ladies, last year.

Edited by widdlewilly

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Signs to avoid? I'd have thought stuff like:-

1/ Advertised as available 24 x 7.

2/ A flat/ set-up where WG's are rotated round from week to week.

3/ Somebody other than WG takes money... or it looks apparent that as soon as you give WG money she goes elsewhere to hand over to somebody else.

Good signs.... things like availability for outcalls (even if its an in call you're going to book), and ability to deal on all aspects of transaction with WG herself.

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Had a bad day dear?
Your out of order. All posters are able to give their opinions as they see fit, Amy is a lovely lady simply posting what she wishes to, it does you no credit to be patronising in my view. Edited by smiths

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Well it's no good asking them is it, because they are obviously terrified.

If it's obvious to you that they're terrified then I would hope that would be a big enough clue, and that you'd call the police or Crimestoppers.

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Firstly read Bottom Liners Defining Trafficking sticky thread in the Legalities Board.

Here, let's make it even easier:

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Here, let's make it even easier:

Thank you Tiggy. Clears it up a bit

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Sorry. Double hit

Edited by widdlewilly

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Signs to avoid? I'd have thought stuff like:-

1/ Advertised as available 24 x 7.

2/ A flat/ set-up where WG's are rotated round from week to week.

3/ Somebody other than WG takes money... or it looks apparent that as soon as you give WG money she goes elsewhere to hand over to somebody else.

Not true at all. These are very common business practices with wgs who are clearly not being coerced.

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Sorry. Double hit

Sorry to repeat myself, but can I be the only punter who has never seen a trafficked Thai girl? Don't know about other nationalities as I'm not interested.

What's your experience Tiggy, if you don't mind me asking?

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Not true at all. These are very common business practices with wgs who are clearly not being coerced.

Go on... tell me... what do you regard as bad signs???

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Signs to avoid? I'd have thought stuff like:-

1/ Advertised as available 24 x 7.

2/ A flat/ set-up where WG's are rotated round from week to week.

3/ Somebody other than WG takes money... or it looks apparent that as soon as you give WG money she goes elsewhere to hand over to somebody else.

Good signs.... things like availability for outcalls (even if its an in call you're going to book), and ability to deal on all aspects of transaction with WG herself.

Good advice.

I've seen a few dubious Chinese/Thai profiles on the other site locally, and when I've rang, it's clearly an older woman who's replied. I've even asked about locations, and different profiles have been in the same area, even down to the same street, so I've generally avoided them. Also, I've kept some on my 'hot list' and noticed that they move around the country too, which pretty much confirms it.

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Go on... tell me... what do you regard as bad signs???

One sign from my experience , is , If she doesn't speak one word of english... Then you wonder " how could she possibly get through passport control ? "

Then you realize , she didn't .

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One sign from my experience , is , If she doesn't speak one word of english... Then you wonder " how could she possibly get through passport control ? "

Then you realize , she didn't .

I've been through a fair number of passport controls without speaking their language.

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I've been through a fair number of passport controls without speaking their language.

I did say English ,didn't I ?

What language do you speak ? Your written English seems fair ?

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An establishment in West Drayton was busted,(had premises in Surbiton too), mainly Oriental ladies, last year.

Which place in Surbiton?

Spock

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Well it's no good asking them is it, because they are obviously terrified.

I guess thats your answer, look into their eyes and if they look terrified walk away.

If you want to avoid those places in the first place, then if a price seems too good to be true it probably is.

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I did say English ,didn't I ?

What language do you speak ? Your written English seems fair ?

I meant other countries passport controls, not UKs.

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Sorry to repeat myself, but can I be the only punter who has never seen a trafficked Thai girl? Don't know about other nationalities as I'm not interested.

What's your experience Tiggy, if you don't mind me asking?

Smiths and I disagree on this one, if not the definition itself, the application. He is immediately put off by the fact that the majority of Thai WGs here originally came voluntarily but accepted a huge 'bond' or debt to cover all the costs of obtaining Thai passports, getting them validated by several trips to neighbouring SEAsian countries, obtaining UK visas (most of them on dubious grounds), arranging accommodations for them in London, adding them to agency websites and steering customers to them, the financial commitment for which ran/runs in excess of £30k. He views this as 'trafficking' because he is appalled at the size of the commitment they have voluntarily made and the questionable grounds that were claimed in order to obtain visas. He may have other reasons, as well, but I think he would agree that I have stated his position fairly. Where I differ with him is that I am not put off by the 'bond' issue because the Thai WG almost certainly entered into it voluntarily (as the only way she could follow the yellow brick road to London) and that most Thai WGs have found themselves able to repay their bond within six months. I accept that I am not sure what happens to the girl who finds herself unable to completely repay her loan or 'bond', that I have no way of being certain that the girl initiated the transaction (v having been prodded into doing so by a family member or friend) in the first place and that I am not as troubled by the questionable legality of her UK visa as I would be if I worked for the UK Border Agency. Not to put too fine a point on this issue, Smiths is not big on Thai WGs whereas I very definitely am. And I may have just defined 'situational ethics' rather than 'trafficking'. :(

The above summary of our differences not withstanding, I have stopped seeing oriental agency WGs in preference to seeing indies, many of whom began as 'bonded' WGs as described above but who subsequently paid off their debt and chose to remain in London as an indie, perhaps also still using agencies for additional bookings. Many of the indies I have found here in London came here as brides of British husbands or with valid visas to become nurses or legitimate students but gravitated toward escorting or massage later. The main reason that I stopped using agencies, however, is because I became disenchanted with the manner in which many agencies treat their WGs AND their clients. It is not a very nice business and most of the practitioners are not very nice people, in my opinion - though I would make a personal exception for Aisha, Olina and, from what I hear, Asian Options if I changed my mind. Others with more current experience than I do, such as Chris, Bill, the Rev, etc, have other agencies that they could recommend, as well. :)

Edited by Tiggy 7

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