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Coventrypunter

Censorship

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So the government thinks internet companies should censor the internet.  These are often foreign companies so have no mandate from the UK public.

So how will they decide what we can all see on the internet?  From what the Guardian rants about? Or the BBC or the Mail. 

Should they censor Adultwork? or punternet? or xhamster?.  Or political sites. Should we be censored from looking at EDL sites or Gates of Vienna because some may find them offensive.

I think the internet should allow all stuff through unless actually illegal (child porn or inciting violence)  and it should be up to the owner of private networks (like parents owning home networks) to decide what their kids can see, hopefully through actually monitoring their usage and also setting parental guidelines on devices and routers.

 

I remeber the struggles when I was teenage against censorship, with stuff like Oz & Lady Chatterleys lover etc against lord longford.  We should not undo what was achieved then.

 

Lets not forget harriet harman is related to Longfords wife.  They dont half keep it in the family :(

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Porn should be filtered by ISPs which then give an opt-in option. It's easy to lock down computers, but kids these days have lots of ways to get unregulated internet access (phones, TVs, gaming consoles).

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Porn should be filtered by ISPs which then give an opt-in option. It's easy to lock down computers, but kids these days have lots of ways to get unregulated internet access (phones, TVs, gaming consoles).

 

A decent router will block content for the whole network, even visiting devices, like friends stuff.

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Censorship is a very dangerous proposition. There will always be a line between what should and shouldn't be censored, and free speech.

 

The huge difficulty with internet censorship is it cross international boundaries. In effect, if you were to try and regulate the internet then you would need every nation in the world to stand together and agree. There are too many differences of opinion, from political to cultural / religious globally that I can't ever see agreement being reached.

 

I am sure everybody here would agree that child pornography is disgusting and has no place anywhere. It is illegal, and rightly so. I applaud any initiatives to eradicate this from the world.

 

However, looking at the wider picture, governments starting to censor or attempting to censor the internet raises its own concerns. Stamp out everything illegal? Sex laws for example, are so antiquated and ambiguous that the average man on the street has no idea on the legalities of escorting. So, do you censor all escort agency web sites, and let the indies carry on, or just pull the plug on all advertising of sex for money on-line?

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So the government thinks internet companies should censor the internet.  These are often foreign companies so have no mandate from the UK public.

So how will they decide what we can all see on the internet?  From what the Guardian rants about? Or the BBC or the Mail. 

Should they censor Adultwork? or punternet? or xhamster?.  Or political sites. Should we be censored from looking at EDL sites or Gates of Vienna because some may find them offensive.

I think the internet should allow all stuff through unless actually illegal (child porn or inciting violence)  and it should be up to the owner of private networks (like parents owning home networks) to decide what their kids can see, hopefully through actually monitoring their usage and also setting parental guidelines on devices and routers.

 

I remeber the struggles when I was teenage against censorship, with stuff like Oz & Lady Chatterleys lover etc against lord longford.  We should not undo what was achieved then.

 

Lets not forget harriet harman is related to Longfords wife.  They dont half keep it in the family :(

I agree with having to opt-in for adult content by proving your an adult, BUT only once as you dont go down in age. However, i have had to opt-in three times with o2 although only the first time did i have to show them ID which i chose to do at an o2 shop.

 

This will be the start of a slippery slope until literally everything is openly monitored (we are already monitored if the authorities and ISPs choose to do so of course) and sold on the "if you arent doing anything wrong whats the problem argument", an argument that in my view will eventually lead to our inevitable future, 24/7 survellience.

 

Get the kiddy porn peddlers and those that access it of course, and other illegal vile stuff, obviously they can do that already though. I do worry about what kids can access online, i have an 18 year old son, and i know he could access porn through his friends connections. I even spoke to one of his mates fathers about it, he wasnt interested, and my son was not happy with me for embarrassing him as he put it. But parents need to take some responsibility to, not JUST rely on government and ISPs to police the net in my opinion. Not an easy issue to resolve.

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A decent router will block content for the whole network, even visiting devices, like friends stuff.

 

New connections are easy to block but there's no easy way to stop the web server built into the kids TV or the web browser in the PlayStation being used to access anything. You'd have to setup a proxy server within your home network, lock that down and keep it running most of the day to have total control over the home network.

 

Parental responsibility can only take you so far - kids are going to be curious and search out stuff.

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Censorship is a very dangerous proposition. There will always be a line between what should and shouldn't be censored, and free speech

 

The huge difficulty with internet censorship is it cross international boundaries. In effect, if you were to try and regulate the internet then you would need every nation in the world to stand together and agree. There are too many differences of opinion, from political to cultural / religious globally that I can't ever see agreement being reached.

 

I am sure everybody here would agree that child pornography is disgusting and has no place anywhere. It is illegal, and rightly so. I applaud any initiatives to eradicate this from the world.

 

However, looking at the wider picture, governments starting to censor or attempting to censor the internet raises its own concerns. Stamp out everything illegal? Sex laws for example, are so antiquated and ambiguous that the average man on the street has no idea on the legalities of escorting. So, do you censor all escort agency web sites, and let the indies carry on, or just pull the plug on all advertising of sex for money on-line?

 

An opt-in system isn't the same as censorship - unless I missed something that was what the government was proposing. Stuff like extreme porn (but not illegal) will still be available, just will require an age-restricted opt-in.

 

ISPs can easily filter 99% of the main sites and make these opt-in only. Still available, so not censored.

 

Of course it's easy with a computer to get around this - just buy a VPN service and create a tunnel to a completely unrestricted part of the Internet, but hopefully by the time the kids know how to do that they really will be old enough from a proper talk and to understand the dangers.

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I agree with having to opt-in for adult content by proving your an adult, BUT only once as you dont go down in age. However, i have had to opt-in three times with o2 although only the first time did i have to show them ID which i chose to do at an o2 shop.

 

This will be the start of a slippery slope until literally everything is openly monitored (we are already monitored if the authorities and ISPs choose to do so of course) and sold on the "if you arent doing anything wrong whats the problem argument", an argument that in my view will eventually lead to our inevitable future, 24/7 survellience.

 

Get the kiddy porn peddlers and those that access it of course, and other illegal vile stuff, obviously they can do that already though. I do worry about what kids can access online, i have an 18 year old son, and i know he could access porn through his friends connections. I even spoke to one of his mates fathers about it, he wasnt interested, and my son was not happy with me for embarrassing him as he put it. But parents need to take some responsibility to, not JUST rely on government and ISPs to police the net in my opinion. Not an easy issue to resolve.

This.When a mate was asking me to set up the pc he had picked up for his young daughter i asked him where he wanted it.Her bedroom was his initial choice.A very popular choice as it keeps the kid quiet and out the way.Trouble is ,you have no idea what they're doing,after all,online,its not just porn you need to worry about.After a little chat he had it put in the living room

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This.When a mate was asking me to set up the pc he had picked up for his young daughter i asked him where he wanted it.Her bedroom was his initial choice.A very popular choice as it keeps the kid quiet and out the way.Trouble is ,you have no idea what they're doing,after all,online,its not just porn you need to worry about.After a little chat he had it put in the living room

 

One computer - that's easy to lock down with something like Microsoft Family Security (giving the daughter a non-admin account on the family computer).

 

Modern households can have a lot more access points, eg multiple mobile phones with wide open Internet access (if the kids don't like the restrictions on the home network they can flip to 3G and gain a wide-open Internet link). iPods and iPads - can be restricted but difficult to keep locked down. Games consoles with open Internet and a TVs with browsers built in.

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One computer - that's easy to lock down with something like Microsoft Family Security (giving the daughter a non-admin account on the family computer).

 

Modern households can have a lot more access points, eg multiple mobile phones with wide open Internet access (if the kids don't like the restrictions on the home network they can flip to 3G and gain a wide-open Internet link). iPods and iPads - can be restricted but difficult to keep locked down. Games consoles with open Internet and a TVs with browsers built in.

 

 

Sorry. why is this difficult?

 

You lock down the home network and put in controls on the router. if you router doesnt do that get another router.  Make sure all computers are locked down, and passworded.  Review and chage the passwords regularly.

 

The kids phones should have barring of adult sites. they will have to prove adulthood by showing ID or a credit card. You can check if they are barred by trying to get onto an adult site.

 

There is no way you can stop them seeing inappropriate material at friends houses.  But when I was a kid we used to swap wank mags so nothing is new.

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We're on a fibre connection - you have to use the modem/router the ISP supply. That has no option to put in any controls other than specifying the times some devices can use the Internet.

 

I guess I could chain two routers together, so the ISP one supplies the single internet link to the second. Set the second up as the DHCP server so everything routes through that, put filters in place on that second router (never seen one which does this, but investigating) and get it to place the first router in a DMZ zone (I think that's what it is called) so no other device on the home network can gateway to the first router. Let me try that ... way off the OP's post; if anybody is interested how this goes, PM me.

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We're on a fibre connection - you have to use the modem/router the ISP supply. That has no option to put in any controls other than specifying the times some devices can use the Internet.

 

I guess I could chain two routers together, so the ISP one supplies the single internet link to the second. Set the second up as the DHCP server so everything routes through that, put filters in place on that second router (never seen one which does this, but investigating) and get it to place the first router in a DMZ zone (I think that's what it is called) so no other device on the home network can gateway to the first router. Let me try that ... way off the OP's post; if anybody is interested how this goes, PM me.

Might be worth contacting the ISP to complain...

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