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Siamese Tomcat

Thailand – When To Hand Over The Cash?

36 posts in this topic

I stumbled across the Pattaya Newbie site and read quite a bit of it earlier today.

 

Most of it tallies closely with my observations and experience during my recent first visit to Patong and there seems to be plenty of really sound advice, but one particular piece of guidance was completely at odds with the way I conducted myself.

 

In London, I always pay the girl immediately; as soon as I’m happy with the room and am confident that I have not been baited and switched, she gets the cash - usually within seconds of arrival. I believe that this is the accepted way of doing business here? I did the same in Thailand.

 

On the tab “Engaging the ladies”, the website advises waiting until the girl is about to depart before rewarding her – the argument being that it will keep her keen and make her provide a better service. I couldn’t disagree more – I believe that, once the girl has the cash, she will relax in the knowledge that she is not going to be ripped off. In my opinion, that will get you a better experience.

 

I punted with bar girls and, on one excessively drunken occasion, a street girl, all from the Bangla red light area. With one exception they all did what was agreed back at the bar, and none of them took advantage.

 

That one exception was a girl who, on arriving at my hotel, immediately dived into the bathroom. A couple of minutes later she meekly emerged and announced that her period had arrived. Without any prompting she opened her handbag, gave me back the bar-fine and went. She could very easily have pointed out that the B500 was back at the bar with the mamasan and claimed that she couldn’t cover it, but she didn’t.

 

Did I do it wrong?

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i guess it all depends on how u are with the girl if u are nice to them they will be nice to you, in singapore i had a girl from vietnam whose english was really limited, but i spoke to her via google translate, what was supposed to be a 30min experience ended up her having a nap with me and offered money back, if you treat girls with respect they will do the same

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I would say that the best thing to do is hand over the cash when she asks for it and if she doesnt then definitely before you leave. Cant really go wrong if you follow that rule

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I think the generally accepted MO is to pay the girl at the end of the short time or long time. I certainly have never paid before either in a go-go or beer bar. Having said that, I have been reading comments that sort mamasans are trying to get payment before you leave a go-go to which you should refuse.

 

Another discussion altogether about whether you agree an amount before or leave that until you have had the experience. You will get varied advice in this one but I think most experienced Thai punters will tell you to pay at the end and not the beginning.

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I think the generally accepted MO is to pay the girl at the end of the short time or long time. I certainly have never paid before either in a go-go or beer bar. Having said that, I have been reading comments that sort mamasans are trying to get payment before you leave a go-go to which you should refuse.

 

Another discussion altogether about whether you agree an amount before or leave that until you have had the experience. You will get varied advice in this one but I think most experienced Thai punters will tell you to pay at the end and not the beginning.

 

It is a minor dilemma - do in Rome as the Romans do, or follow my own instincts.

 

I know it's fluffy, but I sleep better if I do what I'm most comfortable with.

 

Maybe I'll get taught a harsh lesson next holiday?

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In Thailand I've always paid at the end of the session, and I think for the majority of Thai bargirls this is the most accepted scenario. Even at the short-term bars where you can go upstairs to one of the rooms for your ST fun, you'll be asked to pay for the room upfront, but pay the girl afterwards.

 

It's true that occasionally the Mamasan in a go-go bar might exert pressure to pay directly before you leave the bar, but in my experience I have always just paid the barfine and say that I will negotiate with the girl directly - and I've never had any problems with that. 

 

It's up to you whether you negotiate a price beforehand or not - most of the time I prefer to do so, unless you're confident of the 'going rate' in that area, but I know some punters prefer to just pay what they believe is fair after the session. Can risk the ire of a Thai girl who feels she's been undervalued though...

Edited by Soi Cowboy

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If I was on the prowl for a punt, as soon as I saw a girl that I was interested in I'd approach her and ask if I can bar-fine her - even before I sat down and bought a beer.

 

I'll buy a couple of rounds and play a few silly games (I'm brilliant at the nail/hammer game!) and confirm her rate - invariably B500 + B2,000 unless she was a gogo dancer in which case I looked elsewhere. All being well I'll tell her that she can put the fine slip in my cup.

 

I pay my bill at the bar, we'll jump in a tuk-tuk or on a bike taxi and, as I say, I pay the girl the agreed rate as soon as we're back at my hotel and she's "signed in" at reception. I would never pay the full amount back at the bar.

 

I must admit that I was disappointed with the service levels - I never got more than basic boom-boom and reverse oral, which was a complete novelty for them! The day after I got back home I was more than happy to pay treble the rate to my favourite London girl !

 

A couple of my ST bookings turned into over-nights, but that was probably because my room was a lot more inviting than their places, rather than any favours on their parts.

 

You live and learn!

 

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I must admit that I was disappointed with the service levels - I never got more than basic boom-boom and reverse oral, which was a complete novelty for them! The day after I got back home I was more than happy to pay treble the rate to my favourite London girl !

 

 

I would have to agree that the service levels out there don't compare to the established Thai WGs in London. I didn't have any bad experiences on my most recent trip, but services provided could be hit and miss - some liked DFK, some didn't, some liked OWO, some didn't etc etc. Was rare to find the more adventurous type in the go-go bars.

 

That said, Devil's Den in Pattaya employs a selection of girls who are up for pretty much anything; I had a fabulous threesome there with a couple of cuties who were tireless and happy to offer most services including A levels and facials.

 

Have to admit, I love finding a girl who isn't use to receiving reverse oral; had a massage girl in Bangkok who absolutely loved the attention she was getting down there, we had so much fun together I went back to see her again the next day!! 

 

However, like you, a week after getting home I paid a visit to my favourite Thai girl in London and difference in service was night and day... 

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I usually play "hunt the baht" at the end of the session.

 

I always negotiate a hard price, and usually tip it back to somewhere reasonable.

 

so for eg if LT - say she wants 3.5K, negotiate it 2K (its been a while), send her to the bathroom and hide 4 x 500 thb + 3 or 4 x 100 thb notes around the room they play the hot or cold game ("rorn" and "now" in thai respectively). Thai WGs love this kind of inane fun game and love to "find" that extra 200.

 

sounds mental, but any old thai hand on here will know what i'm getting at....

 

I've not tried it with a western WG, and probably wont - i'm sure i'd get a good hard kick in the knackers if i even suggested it  :P

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I usually play "hunt the baht" at the end of the session.

 

I always negotiate a hard price, and usually tip it back to somewhere reasonable.

 

so for eg if LT - say she wants 3.5K, negotiate it 2K (its been a while), send her to the bathroom and hide 4 x 500 thb + 3 or 4 x 100 thb notes around the room they play the hot or cold game ("rorn" and "now" in thai respectively). Thai WGs love this kind of inane fun game and love to "find" that extra 200.

 

sounds mental, but any old thai hand on here will know what i'm getting at....

 

I've not tried it with a western WG, and probably wont - i'm sure i'd get a good hard kick in the knackers if i even suggested it  :P

 

Love it! :D

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 It's well known in Thailand that you pay the lady after the event . If you pay first you leave yourself open to all kinds of excuses and average service . Especially on an overnight , if you pay first you can be pretty sure she will want to leave your room as early as possible .

 

    Money is power there . So while you are holding the cash you have the power and control . When you hand over the cash , you are handing her the power . If you pay after service and feel the service is poor then you hold back some of the money . She will be angry , but she can't really do much .

 

   I know of girls who never got paid at all by some customers .  Too many tourists go to Thai with loads of money and are spoiling it for everyone .

 

   Pay the barfine first to get the girl out of the shop , bar , go go  , where ever , but pay the lady after the fun . She will respect you more for it also . They don't really want to deal with knobheads  .

 

   just my view , but shared by many I know that .

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 It's well known in Thailand that you pay the lady after the event . If you pay first you leave yourself open to all kinds of excuses and average service . Especially on an overnight , if you pay first you can be pretty sure she will want to leave your room as early as possible .

 

    Money is power there . So while you are holding the cash you have the power and control . When you hand over the cash , you are handing her the power . If you pay after service and feel the service is poor then you hold back some of the money . She will be angry , but she can't really do much .

 

   I know of girls who never got paid at all by some customers .  Too many tourists go to Thai with loads of money and are spoiling it for everyone .

 

   Pay the barfine first to get the girl out of the shop , bar , go go  , where ever , but pay the lady after the fun . She will respect you more for it also . They don't really want to deal with knobheads  .

 

   just my view , but shared by many I know that .

 

Well WP, obviously I will acknowledge that you are the expert on punting in Thailand, but in my opinion your whole attitude to Thai WGs, as expressed in virtually every paragraph above, stinks.

 

It seems to me that you gain the “respect” of the girls by bullying and intimidating them and that having “power and control” over an unsophisticated developing-world girl boosts your ego.

 

I would imagine that feeling of power is part of the attraction to the typical sex tourist, but it seems to be a rather out-dated exploitative colonialist attitude.

 

I’ll keep my own home-grown ethics, moral principles and manners with me in Thailand and, if that spoils the game for “everyone”, then that sounds like progress to me.

 

 Just my view , and I don’t give a toss whether anyone shares it.

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I don't know what anyone else does, but I just go with the flow when I'm there. Bar/GoGo girls - the bar fine's paid before you leave, but the girl gets her money after the action. I'd say it's the best way in Thailand for anything really - it's the way they do business. If it's a memorable performance, I always give the girl a bit more, because I'll probably be seeing her again and it's better if she's happy. Years ago I took a ladyboy back (by mistake - I would say that, wouldn't I) to my room. She/he was actually gorgeous. When I realised (she didn't want to take her knickers off) I thought, 'what the heck' I might as well go ahead with it. She gave me the most amazing HJ and oral I've had before or since. She had me hanging on for 2 hours. In the morning I walked her to a taxi and she not once asked me for money. I just remembered I hadn't paid her when she was getting into the taxi and I handed over the 1000 baht.

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Mate, just do what you want, with who you want, where you want and for how much you want. In those famous words "Up to you". But you did ask and the generally accepted method by both girls and punters is pay at the end.

 

WP may well be a bit harsh but his underlying sentiment is right.And don't fall in to the trap that these girls are unspohisticated. They have many tricks up their sleeve. The most obvious is paying her for long time up front and then at 3am (or whatever) she has to duck out for one of any number of well used excuses. You may well,be OK with that but most people aren't.

 

As far as service is concerned, whilst bar girls are wg's, I think they are a mile removed from their "sisters" who invest a fortune to get to the UK in the hope of making a bigger fortune. Come to the UK with a poor performing attitiude and they are in real trouble. In Thailands p4p hot spots, they are their with their mates and sometimes family members and, whilst needing to earn some money, they can also get by satisfactorily without needing to be a star performer.

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 Payday ,  my friend ,   I never claim to be an expert on punting in Thailand .  I think you have taken my post in the wrong way .  I  never bully or intimidate ladies / girls as you say , you misread my postings .

 

   Regarding my exploitative colonialist attitude you mention  , I will remind you that Thailand is the only country in South East Asia  that was never colonized .

 

   Your home grown ethics do not work in other countries , a mistake made by many when overseas .

 

   As gazza  says , up to you  , you can learn the hard way  .   Go your own way . Man of the world  . 

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Mate, just do what you want, with who you want, where you want and for how much you want. In those famous words "Up to you". But you did ask and the generally accepted method by both girls and punters is pay at the end.

 

WP may well be a bit harsh but his underlying sentiment is right.And don't fall in to the trap that these girls are unspohisticated. They have many tricks up their sleeve. The most obvious is paying her for long time up front and then at 3am (or whatever) she has to duck out for one of any number of well used excuses. You may well,be OK with that but most people aren't.

 

As far as service is concerned, whilst bar girls are wg's, I think they are a mile removed from their "sisters" who invest a fortune to get to the UK in the hope of making a bigger fortune. Come to the UK with a poor performing attitiude and they are in real trouble. In Thailands p4p hot spots, they are their with their mates and sometimes family members and, whilst needing to earn some money, they can also get by satisfactorily without needing to be a star performer.

 

Spot on, Gazza.  Considering that PDM started this thread by asking whether he 'did wrong', he then has challenged every subsequent poster who has told him that he did.

 

As for WP's neo-colonialist behaviour in LOS, I can assure anyone who genuinely cares that WP is an absolute 'pussy-cat' when it comes to dealing with TGs.  He is sensible within the limits of his own punting budget but he understands the value of money both to him and to the TGs who are lucky enough to receive his custom and he is generous within those constraints.

 

The Thais have a rather way of describing OP's blunt criticism - 'You talk shit!'.  And, yes, they have told me that on occasion, too.

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 Thailand is the only country in South East Asia  that was never colonized .

I wonder why? I've often wondered - Laos, Cambodia, Miranmar, Malaysia - all the countries bordering Thailand have been colonised. Why not Thailand?

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I wonder why? I've often wondered - Laos, Cambodia, Miranmar, Malaysia - all the countries bordering Thailand have been colonised. Why not Thailand?

 

They were a buffer country between the British and French empires.

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Never thought of that - could be. I was thinking - less politically unstable than nearby countries, more difficult to invade (borders include sea, mountains, jungle, big river) and the nature of the people, possibly, with a tendency to say, 'ok' to everything, then totally ignore you. :D I've heard a story about some Jesuit priests being sent there in the 18th century to try to convert the Thais. The Pope hadn't heard from them for a decade so sent some emissary to see if they'd been dismembered. He turned up and found them living with Thai ladies. Don't know if it's true.

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Well WP, obviously I will acknowledge that you are the expert on punting in Thailand, but in my opinion your whole attitude to Thai WGs, as expressed in virtually every paragraph above, stinks.

It seems to me that you gain the “respect” of the girls by bullying and intimidating them and that having “power and control” over an unsophisticated developing-world girl boosts your ego.

I would imagine that feeling of power is part of the attraction to the typical sex tourist, but it seems to be a rather out-dated exploitative colonialist attitude.

I’ll keep my own home-grown ethics, moral principles and manners with me in Thailand and, if that spoils the game for “everyone”, then that sounds like progress to me.

Just my view , and I don’t give a toss whether anyone shares it.

You are a idiot IMO, you start this thread asking if paying upfront is wrong, then don't like it when you are told, you are a clueless fluffy no doubt using the same mo in Los that you use in the west. WP is correct, in Thailand money is power, it's Thai mentality, as soon as you hand that baht over she subconsciously doesn't have to work for it, and she won't respect you, quite the opposite in fact, Thai women respect strong but fair men, not fluffies he hand their cash over early, they may well make up a jackonory to leave early, as they'd much rather go home or spend some cash on a cute karaoke boy with their friends.

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I just try to keep it simple when I'm in Thailand and fit in with the culture over there. I don't think that's 'neo-colonialist' and even if it was it wouldn't matter, it's just a case of common sense and trying to do the right thing. With most things you buy, apart from with foreign companies, there are no consumer rights and let's face it, when you take a girl back to your hotel, you are buying her time. As Jerboa says, most of them want to get back to their friends. They don't want to be taken for a night out and a candle-lit dinner. They just sit there looking bored - not all, but most do. It's the custom there, when negotiating, to confirm the agreement verbally 3 times. But PDL, don't worry, you won't be ruining things for the rest of us - you're not that powerful.

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Being pedantic, wasn't Thailand over run by Japan in WW2 and co opted into the Japanese sphere of influence? Or does that not count as being conquered?

As Kipling said, East is East and West is West. Things are different. A client if mine from Pakistan said he had great difficulty doing business in the UK as all prices were fixed. He never paid the agreed price back home. So, if thr blokes who monger in Thailand say pay at the end, I'll go with that.

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Being pedantic, wasn't Thailand over run by Japan in WW2 and co opted into the Japanese sphere of influence? Or does that not count as being conquered?

As Kipling said, East is East and West is West. Things are different. A client if mine from Pakistan said he had great difficulty doing business in the UK as all prices were fixed. He never paid the agreed price back home. So, if thr blokes who monger in Thailand say pay at the end, I'll go with that.

 

'The Bridge over the River Kwai'. 

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Being pedantic, wasn't Thailand over run by Japan in WW2 and co opted into the Japanese sphere of influence? Or does that not count as being conquered?

As Kipling said, East is East and West is West. Things are different. A client if mine from Pakistan said he had great difficulty doing business in the UK as all prices were fixed. He never paid the agreed price back home. So, if thr blokes who monger in Thailand say pay at the end, I'll go with that.

Don't mention the war, ruins a good story for the Thais. Come to think of it where did all of the Chinese thais come from, they dominate the middle classes, didn't they come under China's sphere of influence at some point. Actually maybe the point is they were never colonised by the west, other asian countries don't count.

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'The Bridge over the River Kwai'. 

"Victory monument" an important landmark in Bangkok is still standing and celebrates this attempt. It was even inaugurated in presence of representatives of the Japanese Empire and the Third Reich. You will find very few Thais (even very educated) aware of this.

 

it's accurate that Thailand and Siam weren't conquered, but stating this requires to acknowledge that Thailand was an ally of Japan during most of WW2.

 

http://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/17a08r/is_it_true_that_thailand_was_never_conquered/

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