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georgem

Orientals moving on

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I know there is another thread running at the moment with a similar title, but this is a more general and serious topic, though some of the information on the other thread may be examples of what I am talking about. There seems to be a group of places run and staffed by people of Oriental ethnicity where a girl working at these establishments seems to be there for a week and then moves on, to be replaced by another there for a week, etc. There are two such places within ten miles of where I live, so they must be reasonably common.

If you ask the girls, they will tell you they are students, here studying English or some similar story. My concern, and I have stopped using these places for this reason, is that I am bothered as to whether these girls are there of their own free will. I have no evidence that they are not, or I would have reported it. But, there seems to be such an established network, it must have some proper and detailed organisation behind it. You can't run a business, merely hoping that some student girl might just fancy a week off next week and will turn up at your establishment. All this is well planned.

Does the girl who works in one establishment this week move to another one next week in a different part of the country? If so, why? Most working girls try and stay in one place and build up a regular clientele. This is surely how most businesses are run. Moving on seems an odd strategy.

If they don't move on, how is there such a regular supply of young Oriental girls available to work for just one week?

Various sinister possibilities spring to mind. Are the girls doing this voluntarily? Are they beholden to people who have funded their travel here and are repaying debt incurred for education and transportation costs? Are they held to ransom because of family back home in foreign parts who could be used to exert pressure?

It all seems so strange.

Or is it all a figment of my over-active imagination, and they are merely students trying to earn a few extra pounds to avoid crippling student debt or to help impoverished families back home? Plenty of students in this country do work in this industry to fund their education, but they tend to operate from the same place, vacation after vacation, or week to week, not just appear for one week and then disappear.

I can't understand the logic, because even taking into account all the possible sinister explanations, and assuming the worst of them to be correct, why incur the expense of moving them on? The only possible explanation that I can come up with is that, if dodgy, discovery is less likely as relationships with clients do not get built up. But, they are drawing attention to themselves by operating such an unusual practice.

Is it a cause for concern, or merely a curiosity? Perhaps someone wiser, more experienced or with some inside knowledge could enlighten me.

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I used to have a close friendship with a Thai girl who did this. She started off as an escort before moving into this parlour scene. SHe said she did it because she felt she had less chance of being caught by immigaration as she was never in one place longer than a week. She also said that she earned more money this way than when she was an escort, but that probably has more to do with the saturation of the London market with orientals, something that is still quite rare down in Plymouth and Weston-Super-Mare. It did cause her a few problems, but they were more language realated, her ending up in Stafford rather than Stratford upon Avon.

As an aside in terms of pay, she said she used to pay £500 weekly arrangment fee, she'd live in the parlour for the week so no rent, and the parlour would take 50% of her earnings. Given our friendship I see no reason for her to have lied to me on this. She also knew when she was going to have time off, which implies to me that she was at least as in control of her work as most people who work for a living. That said I can see how coercion could be involved in some cases, and given the change in law going through you should be mindful of your new legal culpability.

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I used to have a close friendship with a Thai girl who did this. She started off as an escort before moving into this parlour scene. SHe said she did it because she felt she had less chance of being caught by immigaration as she was never in one place longer than a week. She also said that she earned more money this way than when she was an escort, but that probably has more to do with the saturation of the London market with orientals, something that is still quite rare down in Plymouth and Weston-Super-Mare. It did cause her a few problems, but they were more language realated, her ending up in Stafford rather than Stratford upon Avon.

As an aside in terms of pay, she said she used to pay £500 weekly arrangment fee, she'd live in the parlour for the week so no rent, and the parlour would take 50% of her earnings. Given our friendship I see no reason for her to have lied to me on this. She also knew when she was going to have time off, which implies to me that she was at least as in control of her work as most people who work for a living. That said I can see how coercion could be involved in some cases, and given the change in law going through you should be mindful of your new legal culpability.

Thank you for throwing some light on this topic.

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It bothers me, and I have commented on it in relation specifically to chinese girls because there is other public domain information that suggests the conditions of the girls (and their maids) is not good.

I personally will not go to places where the girls are rotated like this, even as a previous poster suggests the girls are working to an agreement they are comfortable with.

We should however beware of our comfortable perspective, and remember that girls who are here primarily for the benefit of their families, coming from very poor backgrounds, would find the conditions referred to very satisfactory.

Checking posts by Marco Polo will throw some more light on this

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Panda you say about the girls "coming from very poor backgrounds", but this is not always the case - all things are relative. Even in a 'well paid' job in China a girl will only take home around £200 per month and far less if she works in a factory etc. or in Vietnam, Cambodia etc. Whereas she can make that in an evening as a working girl here as well as learning English and maybe meet a husband!

The girls seem to move on because they think they will earn more by moving rather than staying in the same place, especially if they only plan to be here for a few weeks. From my discussions with the girls, it does not seem that the oriental parlor 'network' is particularly well organized, with the arrangments for moving from place to place rather ad hoc. The girl works for a week in one place then contacts other parlors herself to find the next one. The girls who speak reasonable English work as independents when they can't get a week in a new place.

I have not come across any instances where I felt the girl might have been forced to work, either through physical or financial constraints, their motive is to make some money quickly either to help their family or fund some project, such as further education or to buy a property etc.

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I'm going to stop visiting asian massage girls as I've had similar concerns about what is really going on. (Plus I've been to a couple of fairly grotty houses) However, I've met more girls who seem to want to do it, than one's who I've been a bit paranoid about. One girl said she'd be in london the next week, and coming back to the north at a later date, so yes there seems to be an organisation of some kind at work. But also this particular girl said in casual conversation that she was a proffesionally trained massuse and did other more 'conventional' jobs either in massage or at a nail/beauty salon, and another time I met a woman who was genuinely chatty about her studying nursing! So it might not necessarily as sinister as it seems. Possibly to do with immigration rules maybe, but more than likely the people running it aren't not forcing the girls to do.

However, like I said, it's still a bit dubious, and that's not to say there aren't groups out there who do traffick girls, but I'd be pretty quick to give anonymous info to crimestoppers or whoever about such cases.

It's a shame there's not a really nice and established proffesional establishment in the north east which at least has a website etc.

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Checking posts by Marco Polo will throw some more light on this

Thank you. I must start keeping a handy set of links to my relevant posts in response to this old chestnut, so that I don't have to keep writing them afresh. Here's a couple to be going on with:

http://www.punternet.com/forum/showpost.php?p=305809&postcount=21

http://www.punternet.com/forum/showpost.php?p=356807&postcount=166

Short answer: Weekly rotation = standard Chinese business model designed to keep regular punters coming for the "new girls". Nothing unusual about it as far as they are concerned, it suits both the house and the girls.

That would be end of story except that a few operations have indeed proven to be dodgy with debt-bonded and even coerced or deceived girls. Judging by those cases that come to court, this seems to crop up mostly in the provinces.

But most, certainly in London, operate with entirely willing girls here on legitimate visas. There are indeed quite a few genuine students working part-time or even doing a "one-off" week for a quick cash injection. Others, who are simply here to earn cash, working the circuit for periods ranging from a few weeks to a year or more, may well have come in on student visas. Either way, there is no shortage of very willing volunteers.

Building good relationships is perfectly possible with those regulars who keep rotating back to the same houses. As someone else noted, these girls choose which houses to work in and cover their own travel costs.

Feel free to PM me if any points are puzzling you.

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