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Girls under attack!

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As a very occasional punter, I have only recently become aware of the level of crime and theft directed at asian working girls. This may be widespread across all nationalities but the stories that I have heard of late have all been from asian girls who were attacked in their flats by customers who have booked through an agency. The agency have neither offered much in the way of support to the girl, but more importantly have not shared information with other girls (or agencies).

One girl, in particular, only in London for three weeks, was recently robbed along with her flatmate by a customer who had previously booked her on four occasions. He stole both girls' money, wallets, mobile phones and passports at the point of what looked to be a gun. She was so frightened by her ordeal that she could no longer work and went home.

I have subsequently learned that similar events have happened to other girls recently and that the frequency of these attacks and the level of violence used is increasing.

The point of this thread is to hopefully start a constructive discussion on how we, as men who spend time with people who by the nature of their jobs are vulnerable, might be able to help in some way.

I'm not expecting to form a group of vigilantes patrolling the streets of London looking for suspects but it seems that collectively we must surely be able to do more than just walk away and pretend it's none of our business.

I don't know what the solution might be, or even if there is one but there are a lot of people reading this who would feel very frustrated if very many girls also gave up and went home because they were too frightened to open the door.

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As a very occasional punter, I have only recently become aware of the level of crime and theft directed at asian working girls. This may be widespread across all nationalities but the stories that I have heard of late have all been from asian girls who were attacked in their flats by customers who have booked through an agency. The agency have neither offered much in the way of support to the girl, but more importantly have not shared information with other girls (or agencies).

Stories heard from whom? The same agency girls? One bad egg of an agency that has untraceable, thieving clients, a random spate of crimes directed against girls (as an occasional punter you said), you happened to meet? I hope all the girls realised the first port of call was the POLICE. Regardless of whatever, working girls are just as protected by law from this kind of ill treatment as anyone else is - I know myself, having had the odd nasty knock, to know how difficult it is to go ahead and press charges, and not somehow feel you're the guilty party for getting yourself into that sort of situation. It's a natural response, totally illogical though, to want to keep things quiet and lick your wounds, but if it's some kind of ring targetting ladies - contact the police immediately.

I don't know what the solution might be, or even if there is one but there are a lot of people reading this who would feel very frustrated if very many girls also gave up and went home because they were too frightened to open the door.

This isn't anything to do with being a working girl or punting at all, this is to do with them getting robbed. POLICE.

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this is why the govts plan to close down brothels is dangerous as women are obviously safer working in a group than alone

all punters can do is to keep pointing out that womens health,safety & well being is more important than moral judgments,but will the govt listen? do the govt care about sex worker safety?

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As a very occasional punter, I have only recently become aware of the level of crime and theft directed at asian working girls. This may be widespread across all nationalities but the stories that I have heard of late have all been from asian girls who were attacked in their flats by customers who have booked through an agency. The agency have neither offered much in the way of support to the girl, but more importantly have not shared information with other girls (or agencies).

One girl, in particular, only in London for three weeks, was recently robbed along with her flatmate by a customer who had previously booked her on four occasions. He stole both girls' money, wallets, mobile phones and passports at the point of what looked to be a gun. She was so frightened by her ordeal that she could no longer work and went home.

I have subsequently learned that similar events have happened to other girls recently and that the frequency of these attacks and the level of violence used is increasing.

The point of this thread is to hopefully start a constructive discussion on how we, as men who spend time with people who by the nature of their jobs are vulnerable, might be able to help in some way.

I'm not expecting to form a group of vigilantes patrolling the streets of London looking for suspects but it seems that collectively we must surely be able to do more than just walk away and pretend it's none of our business.

I don't know what the solution might be, or even if there is one but there are a lot of people reading this who would feel very frustrated if very many girls also gave up and went home because they were too frightened to open the door.

Great post. I had a similar experience about three weeks ago, possibly with the same WG that that you cited, and it was quite shattering. As it turned out, I booked her the late morning after the incident. I might have been forewarned when I was confronted with a padlock on the iron gate leading to the stairs to her basement flat. She was devastated by the experience and I tried to comfort her but I obviously was not very successful. I actually spoke to her agency immediately after the aborted punt and was assured by them that they were doing everything they could to provide support to her. When I phoned back the following day, I was informed that she was 'on leave' and her departure for Thailand probably was imminent.

I adore oriental WGs, and especially the Thais, but the experience demonstrated the difference between the situations of our local, and most of our EE, WGs here and those of young oriental women who come here to make money as escorts to 'secure their future' back in their home country. They may have visas and they may be studying English and/or doing other jobs here that require a degree of English fluency, but escorting is viewed differently in the West and they come from a completely different culture, having a completely different legal and justice system, thousands of miles from their families (and often their own child, who is being minded by their mother) and are particularly vulnerable. In the case of an oriental woman who has been robbed, she is terrified at the thought of going to the police (partly due to the way the police in their home country might treat the incident), they would like to be able to receive support from the agency that employs them but agency owners are unlikely to go the the police either (even though they may know the identity of the perpetrator, having booked the session on behalf of the woman in the first place). And a punter like me, who would love to help them secure justice, feels completely helpless.

This is not a thread for the 'Dangerolus Punter Warnings' board. The girl who was victimised is no longer in England and details of the perpetrator, at least in this case, are almost impossible to obtain or verify - though the agency could provide useful clues if they were so minded. Warning about this particular punter would be pointless (all I was told was that he was an Indian, but I certainly would not advise trying to 'profile' Indian punters, some of whom have enough difficulty as it is).

I will be interested to hear what the British professionals here who also are punters would advise. OP has highlighted a significant issue that should be of interest to ALL posters on this board, punter and escort alike. I would love to see or hear some constructive points made here, without a lot of moralising about the risks that WGs take, the rewards that they may or may not receive, or a new round of Buy British campaigning.:D

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Great post. ...they would like to be able to receive support from the agency that employs them but agency owners are unlikely to go the the police either (even though they may know the identity of the perpetrator, having booked the session on behalf of the woman in the first place). And a punter like me, who would love to help them secure justice, feels completely helpless.

:

Why not begin by naming and shaming the agency. If an agency will not protect its girls, punters are at risk too. How many of you would be happy having the police interview you when something turns really nasty!

Avoid the agency like the plague.

Jack

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This isn't about punting, this is about theft.

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I don't frankly care what somebody does for a living if it they don't hurt other people. If I could help to protect them I would. What are you frightened of? Feeling good about doing the right thing?

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Stories heard from whom? The same agency girls? One bad egg of an agency that has untraceable, thieving clients, a random spate of crimes directed against girls (as an occasional punter you said), you happened to meet? I hope all the girls realised the first port of call was the POLICE. Regardless of whatever, working girls are just as protected by law from this kind of ill treatment as anyone else is - I know myself, having had the odd nasty knock, to know how difficult it is to go ahead and press charges, and not somehow feel you're the guilty party for getting yourself into that sort of situation. It's a natural response, totally illogical though, to want to keep things quiet and lick your wounds, but if it's some kind of ring targetting ladies - contact the police immediately.

This isn't anything to do with being a working girl or punting at all, this is to do with them getting robbed. POLICE.

I don't mean to sound unkind, May, but your own situation could not be more different than those of the girls in question. They are NOT univeristy (Oxbridge?) educated "part-oriental, well-travelled hedonists'. Your typically-flip response (and I confess that I usually chuckle at your typically-flip responses) helps illustrate the gulf that exists between the British WG (and you are one, part-oriental or not) and many of the foreign WGs who have come to this country to add variety and spice to the punting world. Are you seriously suggesting, especially given the current climate during the painful death throes of the present government, that these oriental girls (or any non-EU girls) should stroll into the nearest police station and plead for help?:D

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Why the reluctance to name the agency?

Its a matter for the police, but, if the agency are crap then they should be names.

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Why not begin by naming and shaming the agency. If an agency will not protect its girls, punters are at risk too. How many of you would be happy having the police interview you when something turns really nasty!

Avoid the agency like the plague.

Jack

If I were convinced that this particular incident was not a 'one-off', I would do so. I certainly will pay more attention to their practices in the future and, if justified, will make this information known. And this is part of the problem - getting the whole truth and nothing but the truth. In the case of the Thai girl I mentioned, I had no doubt that she was telling me the truth, however.:D

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This isn't anything to do with being a working girl or punting at all, this is to do with them getting robbed. POLICE.

Neatly said, May (and correctly)!

Theft Act 1968

8 Robbery

(1)A person is guilty of robbery if he steals, and immediately before or at the time of doing so, and in order to do so, he uses force on any person or puts or seeks to put any person in fear of being then and there subjected to force.

(2)A person guilty of robbery, or of an assault with intent to rob, shall on conviction on indictment be liable to imprisonment for life.

If it carries a max of life, that means that the Talking Shop at Westminster thinks it is really serious and it honestly isn't the girl's choice whether to go to the Polis or not. She has a duty to make statements, tell the reall truth, and, if push comes to shove, to give evidence against a robber. I very much doubt that robbers stick only to WG (even though they probably do have substantial sums in used twenties) but probably do little old ladies too.

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I don't mean to sound unkind, May, but your own situation could not be more different than those of the girls in question. They are NOT univeristy (Oxbridge?) educated "part-oriental, well-travelled hedonists'. Your typically-flip response (and I confess that I usually chuckle at your typically-flip responses) helps illustrate the gulf that exists between the British WG (and you are one, part-oriental or not) and many of the foreign WGs who have come to this country to add variety and spice to the punting world. Are you seriously suggesting, especially given the current climate during the painful death throes of the present government, that these oriental girls (or any non-EU girls) should stroll into the nearest police station and plead for help?:D

May is right, the police are there to fight crime, why should the girls be scared of the police force here if they have not committed any crime and are here legally. All very well the knight in shining armour attitude to "these poor girls" but I think you are promoting a really crappy view here like they are dolls who cannot think for themselves. If that is the case as you put it, then it sounds like a whole lot of women are being taken advantage of and should they really be here and patronised by men in this country if they cannot take care of basic looking after themselves?? ..Yes the agency should be named and shamed too. This country is not a police state yet and people are freely able to report crimes against occurring against them and I would urge anyone who had been subjected to theft or violence to do so without repercussion.

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I don't mean to sound unkind, May, but your own situation could not be more different than those of the girls in question. They are NOT univeristy (Oxbridge?) educated "part-oriental, well-travelled hedonists'.

Yes, I'm proudly an ex-member of a Cambridge college that got one of the lowest ever scores on University Challenge. So what? I'm too posh to comment? But aside from that, it seems we can argue about nothing, reading on....

Your typically-flip response (and I confess that I usually chuckle at your typically-flip responses) helps illustrate the gulf that exists between the British WG (and you are one, part-oriental or not) and many of the foreign WGs who have come to this country to add variety and spice to the punting world. Are you seriously suggesting, especially given the current climate during the painful death throes of the present government, that these oriental girls (or any non-EU girls) should stroll into the nearest police station and plead for help?:D

What gulf? Despite me being a punting pond member, as in another post in this thread where I mentioned how difficult it was for me to contact the police when I was robbed - I can understand it's hard for girls to think they're protected, being "naughty" - regardless of culture. The police, I found, were very understanding. Oriental, non-EU, Klingon...police, that's the first port of call. Regardless of education. A crime's been committed. Are you seriously saying, don't report it? Anyone in contact with these girls should let them know that they are protected by law, and regardless of what their "cultures" regard working girls as, they deserve to be protected. Language difficulties aside, they should have one of the many WG groups details.

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Yes, I'm proudly an ex-member of a Cambridge college that got one of the lowest ever scores on University Challenge. So what? I'm too posh to comment? But aside from that, it seems we can argue about nothing, reading on....

What gulf? Despite me being a punting pond member, as in another post in this thread where I mentioned how difficult it was for me to contact the police when I was robbed - I can understand it's hard for girls to think they're protected, being "naughty" - regardless of culture. The police, I found, were very understanding. Oriental, non-EU, Klingon...police, that's the first port of call. Regardless of education. A crime's been committed. Are you seriously saying, don't report it? Anyone in contact with these girls should let them know that they are protected by law, and regardless of what their "cultures" regard working girls as, they deserve to be protected. Language difficulties aside, they should have one of the many WG groups details.

SM

If you look at Belle de Jour request for research input, you will find this quote:

According to 'Hansard' : 528 arrests, 71 charged. 167 'victims' of which 48 were deported.

Perhaps the idea of deportation does not appeal!

Jack

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I don't mean to sound unkind, May, but your own situation could not be more different than those of the girls in question. They are NOT univeristy (Oxbridge?) educated "part-oriental, well-travelled hedonists'. Your typically-flip response (and I confess that I usually chuckle at your typically-flip responses) helps illustrate the gulf that exists between the British WG (and you are one, part-oriental or not) and many of the foreign WGs who have come to this country to add variety and spice to the punting world. Are you seriously suggesting, especially given the current climate during the painful death throes of the present government, that these oriental girls (or any non-EU girls) should stroll into the nearest police station and plead for help?:D

Yes!! Being beaten up and your cash stolen doesnt hurt anymore,or make you feel any more powerless just because your an oriental female,it would feel the same no matter what walk of life your from for gods sake. I have complete sympathy for ladies this happens too,regardless of where they are from.Im sorry but i dont understand what the current political climate has got to do with reporting a crime at all.If this happened to myself i would be in two minds wether to report it or not simply because i would not want it to leak out what job i do.Ladies who come here from abroad are at least protected from that in that thier families are thousands of miles away so highly unlikely to find out.I think the problem may lie in that many ladies who come here to be wg,s maybe dont have the legal papers to be working here at all,which would explain the reluctance to involve the police. The agency should have though to protect other ladies in that area a little.I dont think mays answer is flippant at all,if someone is here legally then there is no reason to be scared to go to the police,and the agency should have explained that to the girls.xx

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May is right, the police are there to fight crime, why should the girls be scared of the police force here if they have not committed any crime and are here legally. All very well the knight in shining armour attitude to "these poor girls" but I think you are promoting a really crappy view here like they are dolls who cannot think for themselves. If that is the case as you put it, then it sounds like a whole lot of women are being taken advantage of and should they really be here and patronised by men in this country if they cannot take care of basic looking after themselves?? ..Yes the agency should be named and shamed too. This country is not a police state yet and people are freely able to report crimes against occurring against them and I would urge anyone who had been subjected to theft or violence to do so without repercussion.

More than slightly bemused that your attack is against the post rather than the subject of the post. I don't believe for a minute that any working girl is a "doll" or a "poor girl". But, if you could be bothered to be constructive, you might be suggesting how somebody from a fundamentally different culture might be assured that the police could help and support them rather than sniping at people who whether you like it or not would actually like to help.

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Why the reluctance to name the agency?

Its a matter for the police, but, if the agency are crap then they should be names.

Tiggy

Was the agency by any chance Asian Selection? If not, perhaps you would enlighten us.

Jack

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SM

If you look at Belle de Jour request for research input, you will find this quote:

According to 'Hansard' : 528 arrests, 71 charged. 167 'victims' of which 48 were deported.

Perhaps the idea of deportation does not appeal!

Jack

The girls robbed on this particular occasion were here legally on tourist visas. No immigration issues. How about we talk about what to do about the criminals and stop accusing the victims?

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I am not in total agreement that the agency should be named and shamed though,did they commit the robbery,no. They may have offered to contact the police and had their help refused,if you dont know the whole story its unfair. I worked for the old charlies angels escort agency 6 years ago in milton keynes,i was almost attacked on an outcall and was threatened with a knife,my driver called the police whilst kicking in the door,the agency owner called the police and turned up armed with a metal baseball bat and his enraged girlfriend ready to batter the twat,the police got there first and were slightly amused at the sight of the bat brandishing. They said he was a little heavy handed as the bat was metal not wood,but they felt he was protecting an employee so gave him a handshake.They also offered to back me up fully if i took it to court,i didnt,i didnt want to risk my children finding out.It happens.xx

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As a very occasional punter, I have only recently become aware of the level of crime and theft directed at asian working girls. This may be widespread across all nationalities but the stories that I have heard of late have all been from asian girls who were attacked in their flats by customers who have booked through an agency. The agency have neither offered much in the way of support to the girl, but more importantly have not shared information with other girls (or agencies).

One girl, in particular, only in London for three weeks, was recently robbed along with her flatmate by a customer who had previously booked her on four occasions. He stole both girls' money, wallets, mobile phones and passports at the point of what looked to be a gun. She was so frightened by her ordeal that she could no longer work and went home.

I have subsequently learned that similar events have happened to other girls recently and that the frequency of these attacks and the level of violence used is increasing.

The point of this thread is to hopefully start a constructive discussion on how we, as men who spend time with people who by the nature of their jobs are vulnerable, might be able to help in some way.

I'm not expecting to form a group of vigilantes patrolling the streets of London looking for suspects but it seems that collectively we must surely be able to do more than just walk away and pretend it's none of our business.

I don't know what the solution might be, or even if there is one but there are a lot of people reading this who would feel very frustrated if very many girls also gave up and went home because they were too frightened to open the door.

As others have said name and shame, IMO that is one of the reasons to be a member here, to share information good and bad. In this case you say the Agency have neither offered much help to the lady or shared information so naming and shaming here might help others which the Agency is not prepared to do.

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More than slightly bemused that your attack is against the post rather than the subject of the post. I don't believe for a minute that any working girl is a "doll" or a "poor girl". But, if you could be bothered to be constructive, you might be suggesting how somebody from a fundamentally different culture might be assured that the police could help and support them rather than sniping at people who whether you like it or not would actually like to help.

Well if you would like to get the girls to contact me or any number of ladies on this forum I would be more than happy to help them, I have been attacked in a foreign country myself and I know what it feels like but I had the know how to report it to the police. I have also been a victim of violence in this country and the police were more than helpful regardless of my profession. Or put them in touch with Saafe. And it's you who is sniping at me now. You men have no idea what some of girls in this profession have had to deal with myself included.

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Legality - are they here legally?

However, if I was being robbed by clients, bugger legality, like Tiggy's girl, I'd go back home. However, what is going to happen to the next girl who drops into her shoes? Is there a ring? If there's a dodgy agency relying on the fact the girls never complain, it should be outed to the police, not here. Otherwise other girls will end up in the same situation.

Hilariously, people still think with me being a little slitty-eyed and thin, ask why I do this job, like I'm some sort of refugee that turned to whoring because I was starving. Bless. No, it fits in with my life, I enjoy it, all good by the way. Hearing about this sort of thing, stealing off the vulnerable, infuriates me - the people hurt, and on a just profession the more I have to explain AGAIN what I do to my friends. It's legal, blameless, and short of getting told off by Trading Standards or something for having hopeful photos up, we should keep the front firm - nothing to be guilty of. Clued up traders looking for prosperous encounters, etc.

Any client who meets the girls spoken of, get them in touch with SAAFE. I'm willing to take any of these Thai ladies to the police personally, after feeding them some preserved horse crab som tam. In all seriousness. That agency should be named and shamed, and the owners locked up.

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Tiggy

Was the agency by any chance Asian Selection? If not, perhaps you would enlighten us.

Jack

Same answer, Jack. The agency may or may not be AS, but the problem is a more general one, involving more than one agency, and there must be alternative solutions for the foreign WGs than just 'call the police'. That is what you would do or I would do, and it probably is what 9 out of 10 western WGs would do, but it is NOT what an oriental WG, or a WG from a culture completely different from ours is likely to do. I respect the views of all the British WGs who have commented here, though I don't propose to try to answer every post. If someone has a different/alternative approach that I think would actually play out happily in real life, the sound of my applause will be deafening. Moralising makes people feel good but in this case it does not really help the young women in question.:D

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SM

If you look at Belle de Jour request for research input, you will find this quote:

According to 'Hansard' : 528 arrests, 71 charged. 167 'victims' of which 48 were deported.

Perhaps the idea of deportation does not appeal!

Jack

Perhaps in the cases of the deported persons,applying for the correct visa so they could work in this country legally also did not appeal!

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Well if you would like to get the girls to contact me or any number of ladies on this forum I would be more than happy to help them, I have been attacked in a foreign country myself and I know what it feels like but I had the know how to report it to the police. I have also been a victim of violence in this country and the police were more than helpful regardless of my profession. Or put them in touch with Saafe. And it's you who is sniping at me now. You men have no idea what some of girls in this profession have had to deal with myself included.

If that is an offer to help I will more than happily, and gratefully, point the girls in your direction.

You are right, I really do have no idea what you have to deal with, perhaps I should. I just do not understand why anybody should have to put up with this to earn a living, without hurting anybody, the way they choose.

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